DAAG: INTERVIEWS: GITI NOUROZIAN

Interviews

The Directories of American Art Galleries

An Interview with

Giti Nourozian

by James Leonard-Amodeo

Can you tell us a bit about your ethnic background?

I was born in Tehran in 1968, but my father and ancestors were originally from North-east part of Iran which is called Khorasan province. All my life was spent in Tehran where I graduated from high school in 1986, and from 1988 to 1992 attended the Art Faculty at the Alzahra University in Tehran where I studied painting. I married in 1991. During the university years I worked as a part-time art consultant, but professionally I have always worked as a painter.

Your English is quite good. Where did you learn the language?

Because I'm interested in communicating with others, and realizing the necessity to learn English, I decided to study the language in a foreign linguistic institute where I remained for two years, complimenting my studies by doing lots of homework.

I suppose you can see from your experience how necessary it is that humanity adapt a universal, auxiliary language that people can speak throughout the planet, especially today, when the necessity to communicate becomes more and more imperative.

Yes, it is definitely necessary to have a universal language. But if this universal language should be chosen from an existing one, like English, for example, this means that those who already speak English don't need to learn it. But non-English speakers will have to spend lots of time learning it, and even when it is learned, it could never be transmitted as clearly as the native speaker could do it. Imagine how many hours I have had to study just to communicate with you in English! And even though I am able to speak to you in English, you can see all the mistakes I make! Don't you think it is unfair to us non-English speakers that English should be the universal language?

I'm not saying that English should be THE universal language because then it would be like saying that Impressionism should be the universal painting style, and this would be unfair. If we didn't have diversity and variety this life would be extremely dull. So, diversity and variety are good to have. What I personally propose is that all the governments of the earth should select a number of professional and knowledgeable linguists from their country's best universities, and these linguists should form an International Linguistic Committee. The purpose of this Committee would be to invent a new language. Once the language is created, it should be taught in all the schools of the world as an auxiliary language to the mother tongue. Because all governments of every ethnic group on the planet have contributed to this Committee, nobody would feel they have been left out. Then, when the new auxiliary language has been created, this should be taught in every school of the earth. In just one generation everyone would speak this auxliary language and wherever a person travels on the earth he would have no difficulty communicating. Imagine how much richer an artist's life could be if he could communicate with artists in any country of the world!

I absolutely agree with you. About a hundred years ago something like this language you suggest was invented by Mr. Zamenhof, the Polish physician, which he called Esperanto. About twenty years ago, in Iran there was interest in this language among the younger people. In spite of the easy grammar and the blessings from the United Nations, Esperanto didn't (and probable won't) become the international language. I am not a linguist and have no idea why it didn't succeed as the universal language of the planet.

But the free exchange of ideas between peoples of diverse cultures and international communications is not limited just by language alone. People around the world should try to understand and respect each other's nationality, religion, race, and so on. Once this mutual respect of differences has become reality, a universal language could be developed which would strengthen relations between peoples of the planet. If this language were one which could be easily learned and taught in every country of the world, the connection between nations would become ideal. Although I believe this new, universal language should be an easy one, or one that is easy to teach and learn, it still has to be rich in vocabulary and grammar in order to be able to express feelings, beliefs, ideas, and so on.

Was anyone in your family an artist?

Yes, there is interest in Art in my family, but no one works in this field professionally.

What attracted you to the visual fine art of painting?

The first time I went to a painting class I was aged 12. The thought of creating something beautiful on paper or canvas with colors was very attractive to me. Even today I continue to ask myself what it was, specifically, that pulled me into this profession. Painting has always been a mystery to me. But today it is a mystery in a different way. When I was younger all I wanted to do was just draw something realistically, to depict a flower like a flower. But over time, little by little, this perception has changed. The private painting classes continued until I began university.

Tell me more about the "mystery" that you find in painting. Is the act of painting a mystical experience for you?

No, I don't mean that the act of painting is a mystical experience. Maybe I could refer this mystery to my feelings. I never think ahead about what I want to paint. The subject matter comes to mind spontaneously, instantaneously. Sometimes an idea comes to me in a continuous way, non-stop, and sometimes ideas don't come for weeks! Once the idea pops into my mind I immediately put it to canvas. Most of the time the result on canvas is somewhat different from the original idea since I don't force myself to be faithful to the main sketch. The mystery is how everything goes on and on unintentionally; how my feelings and character are revealed and made obvious for others to see; how I choose colors and put them together which later are interpreted subjectively and uniquely by each viewer; I don't know how all of this is done. It's a big mystery. It is absolutely complicated for me to understand, as well.

How long have you been a professional painter, then?

Since 1992.

What did they teach you at the university in Tehran? Who were some of your teachers?

To get your BA in the fine arts you need to study 4.5 years here. The curriculum consists of practical subjects like drawing, painting, basic rules, knowing colors, printing, photography, experiencing different styles like Cubism, Realism, and so on. We also learn the world history of art as well as the history of art in Iran. The study provides students with the ability to analyze a work of art, no matter what it is, such as paintings, elements in graphic arts, sculpture, handicrafts, etc.. Because I graduated 10 years ago, I can't remember all the details of the curriculum. But I can tell you that, besides arts, the curriculum includes such general subjects as language, sports, literature, and some religious education. In the final stages students have to prepare a thesis and oral presentation on painting. I remember that my own thesis was on the subject of analyzing Miniatures in the Safavid era. Such an analyses was done based on European standards, and because of this it caused quite a debate in the university between instructors.

Who are the artists you admire most and who helped in your artistic development?

There were a lot of "masters" in university, but none of them helped me specifically in my development. I became familiar with technique, history, etc., but not any unique style.

I don't quite understand; do you mean to say you didn't study the Renaissance, Mannerism, Romanticism, Realism, Impressionism, etc., at university? Also, who were these "masters" at the university? Were there any women?

Yes, we received the opportunity to experience the different traditional painting styles, but they didn't introduce the newer forms of painting. These newer forms had to be learned through personal hard work. Once I had all this background baggage, I felt I was ready to start a professional painting career, which thing I did immediately after leaving university. My own style was developed after many years of trial and error and I have never relied on other artists to achieve the style I practice today.

With respect to your last question, yes, we had lots of women artists at the university. They worked in both categories: theory and practical.

Who are the artists that you like most?

There are many. But here are a few: Durer, Titian, Rubens, Michelangelo, Poussin, Rembrandt, Vermeer, Velazquez, Hals, Chardin, Utamaro, Hokusai, Hiroshige, William Turner, Dummier, van Gogh, Toulouse-Lautrec, Paul Gauguin, Matisse, Picasso, and such contemporary Iranian Artists as Sohrab Sepehri, Hossain Kasemi, and Jafar Rouhbakhsh.

So it seems you are very open-minded. Have you studied the techniques of all these painters?

I can't say I have experienced all the techniques. I learned a lot, however, by analyzing their works either through art books or through my frequent museum visits.

Why these in particular? Is there something specific that attracts you to the works of these painters?

Each artist has something unique to teach. They affected the art of their time in a very powerful way -- they changed the way artists painted! For instance, Durer was very strong on drawing and Gauguin on color. In fact, Gauguin's colors absolutely appeal to me.

What mediums do you prefer to work with?

I prefer Acrylic because it has a fast drying time. This helps me achieve different textures and I love textures. I also do collage because I can express myself on the spur of the moment spontaneous creation.

Do you work with live models or from photographs?

To practice drawing I work with live models. But for painting, I use neither of them. My paintings are absolutely imaginary, from inside, from my feeling.

What would you say are the greatest challenges facing a painter today?

I would say, exhibiting is very important. I am very interested in showing my works to different people. I guess most artists' are. Different culture, different idea, and different views. But you know, artists living in my part of the world don't get many opportunities to connect with galleries around the world.

Why is this, do you think? Why are there very few opportunities in Iran for artists to become internationally recognized?

One main reason is that international art critics don't know much about Iranian artists or art galleries. There aren't frequent invitations from international exhibitions in this country. Secondly, even if I could pass the difficult stages of finding a gallery abroad and convince the manager to exhibit my paintings, it would be very difficult getting a visa from the foreign embassy. In spite of the fact that I get a considerable number of foreign invitations, the difficulty begins when I am asked to do the many screening interviews by these foreign governments and this entails filling out mountains of paper applications. In the end, the chances of successfully passing such interviews are so slim that one gives up hope.

The younger you are, the smaller the chances that you will get a visa. There are many artists who aspire to pass the screenings but fail to do so. Only a handful pass through the entire procedures, and these are usually artists supported by government organizations. Once an artist is selected by such an organization, he is called and informed that he will be participating in an international exhibition and will be given all the necessary documents and facilities, such as a visa, accommodations, and all expenses paid.

This sounds like an appalling situation. Doesn't this make you feel like a prisoner?

It actually sounds worse than it really is. People here are free to go wherever they like. The Iranian government doesn't force anybody to stay here. The problem is getting a visa from the foreign countries. Artists can develop their art as they wish here, but when the individual desires to exhibit outside the country, the foreign embassies make it really hard for us to be accepted in their country. And that's the real problem.

What about religious restrictions in Iran as applied to the artist?

The only restriction worth mentioning is that artists cannot exhibit paintings with nude forms in any Iranian Art Gallery.

Do you use any special formula in pricing your work?

Yes, I do. My pricing scheme includes such consideration as cost of the frame, Dealer's commission, transportation, size of the work, cost of materials besides the frame and, finally, the idea, feeling, time, and as a whole art value.

How can you put a price on the "idea", "feeling", "time", and "art value". What do you mean by this?

The moment of conception to the final production is an important determinant in price. The emotional investment and intrinsic value of the art is a pricing factor inclusive in the field of fine arts. It is absolutely difficult to explain how all of this is arrived at and much more difficult to analyze it. I use this general scheme to help me to evaluate a work, but there is no fixed formula. In the end, the final price of a piece is achieved after negotiations with the gallery manager.

In today's world economic climate, do you think it has become more difficult selling art?

Yes, absolutely. Especially for artists like me who are from a nation considered a "Third World" country. We have very few opportunities to show our work and to find buyers who like what we do. In fact, such opportunities are very few and far between.

So, what do you do to sell your art? Where do you show it? How do you show your art to potential buyers? How can you afford to continue being a fine artist in such a difficult art environment?

To sell my art here all I need do is stage a public exhibition. There are also many galleries in Tehran where artists can show their work. But the exhibition time in such galleries is very limited (between 7 to 10 days). If I'm lucky some of my work might sell in such a short time. Otherwise, there's no chance of earning money at all. I do try to have exhibitions abroad, and also introduce my works to others through the internet. I can afford to do this because until now I have been very successful in selling my art. Secondly, I have many private students which helps with the income. Finally, my husband has a good income and this contributes to the overall success I've experienced.

I don't feel moving from this country to another place would help me artistically as I get my feelings and ideas here. Iranian culture has always been an inspiration to me and I feel that if I should move away I will most probably lose this source of inspiration. Despite the insurmountable difficulties I experience as an artist in my own country, yet I don't want to leave. But this conviction might change in the future. I don't know.

Tell us a bit about the art market in Teheran.

Because the Iranian economy is not healthy, the art market here is not very good. Although one might get the wrong idea from seeing some of my work on my website marked as "Sold," the fact is that most of the pieces I've sold have been bought by foreign buyers, not by Iranians. This doesn't mean that Iranians don't love modern painting; it means they can't afford it. And people who can afford to buy it don't understand art at all!

What needs to be done, in your opinion, to change the current Iranian mentality toward acceptance of modern art?

There is a lot of work to be done. They should provide people with knowledge of modern art through books, TV programs, and magazines. Familiarize people with the arts in the world. Eliminating prejudices and opening borders to the worldwide arts community would be of immense help, but none of these things have been attempted and Iran remains a very closed community culturally. Another factor is the annual per capita income. Efforts should be made to increase this so that people live a more comfortable lifestyle with money to spend on such things as art.

I note that today there are more women artists than men, at least this is true in the West. You're a woman, so I'd like to ask your opinion: Why do you feel women are more attracted to the fine arts today than men?

I can only give you my view of things in my country. In Iran, most men have to work very hard and long hours because of the economic crises, and this hardwork doesn't pertain to artists since, no matter how hard an artist works, there just isn't enough income to provide for a normal lifestyle. There are some exceptions, of course, even in Iran. For example, artists who are supported by the government usually earn enough to continue doing what they do. But these are very exceptional cases.

I don't have specific statistics, but it seems there are more women artists than men, even in my country. Art is something which seems to satisfy women more than men today. It might be because the spirit of art provides women with a greater pleasure than anything else could. Also, I believe art might be more for women nowadays because women are less concerned with the monetary recompense of a profession. Men are geared toward jobs that pay more money and being an artist is certainly not the type of job that provides the income men seek. So, this might be one of the important factors which finds more women involved in the arts than men.

From what we Westerners know about Iranian society, it seems it is still quite backward when it comes to giving women the same rights that men enjoy. Is this a fair assessment? As a woman, how did you succeed in escaping the traditional mold of Iranian culture?

I don't know how much information you get about Iran in the West. Because of my second job -- which is as a tour leader -- I connect with lots of foreigners. Mostly, they think we have an Arabic culture, which is not true. Although, there are lots of limitation because of our laws and traditions, yet we do have many opportunities, as well.

What are some of these legal and traditional limitations, for example?

There is a mix of limitations originating in Iranian laws, the different local traditions, and Islamic rules. Some women continue fighting for their rights in my country but at present there is no way of escaping the imposed limitations. For example, to get a passport to travel abroad, a woman needs her husband's permission. Another example is the Islamic rule of Hijab which dictates that a woman must wear a scarf whenever outside the home. This is not the same law as that practiced in Afghan where women had to cover themselves from head to toe. In Iran women simply have to wear a scarf (as you can see in my photos) and a uniform, but women here are not satisfied with this and demand a greater freedom from the dress code. Yet another example is the absolute restriction against showing or depicting nudes. This is against Islamic beliefs. Everything connected to sex is a taboo here as can be seen in the strong Iranian taboo against sex before marriage. In brief, we Iranian women would like more freedom to do as our conscience dictates but at present we must follow the laws, traditions and rules.

You said earlier that the market of art buyers is very limited and most of your own art is sold to foreign interests, not to Iranians. Why is the art market so bad in your country? Are Iranians generally ignorant of the value of art as a cultural contribution? Are there many art galleries in Teheran?

There are lots of galleries in Tehran. The art market is what it is here not because of a shortage of places to show one's art, but because of the economic crises. The average salary is very low, which means that for ordinary people it is difficult to buy a painting when they need all the money they have for daily essentials like food. One solution, of course, would be to lower our prices so that our art becomes affordable to the oridinary man on the street. But this is almost impossible to do because paint, frames, and the rest of the basic materials necessary to produce and present a piece of artwork are very expensive here. As you can see, then, the situation is not very promising both for the artist or for the people until and unless the economic situation changes dramatically. But I can tell you this: the Iranian people are not ignorant when it comes to traditional art. They are familiar with, and appreciate carpetmaking, handicrafts, and so on. They do need to be educated on modern arts, however.

In 1999 you did an exhibit at the Sayhun Gallery of Tehran. Can you tell us how you succeeded in getting into this gallery? Did you sell many pieces there?

This gallery is one of the best in Iran. So I did a request for an interview with the gallery manager and showed her my work. She liked what I did and allowed me to exhibit in her gallery for a limited time. So, soon I had an exhibition of my work there and I was lucky enough to sell some of my pieces.

Also, in 2000 and 2001 your art appeared at the Galerie d'art le Palais Orientel in Montreux, Switzerland. Can you tell us how you got into that gallery and the results?

My brother lived in Switzerland and this provided the platform and chance to show there. When I visited him in 2000 I checked out the gallery scene and a found a gallery where I thought my art could fit. I spoke with the manager and he accepted to show some of my works in an exhibition with other Iranian painters. The following year an Iranian artist and myself travelled to Switzerland together to exhibit our works. The overall results were good and many people became familiar with Iranian artists through this exhibit. The sales were also good.

Your art also appeared at The Gallery 01 in London, England. Please tell us about this exhibition.

I lived in England for six months because my husband was there on business. During the six-month stay, I checked all the exhibitions which had been announced in an artist magazine. I eventually found an art gallery where foreign artists were welcomed to exhibit. So I decided to participate. The chances of showing in other galleries was very limited because some of them didn't work with foreign artists. Additionally, some of the galleries were highly specialized in such fields as animals, landscapes, watercolors, and so on. So, my work didn't fit.

From the pieces I've seen of your art, the style borders very much on abstract art, intermingled with figurative work. It's a sort of mixture between abstract and figurative. Is this your direction? Do you lean more towards abstract than other styles?

I do lean more toward abstract art, yes, but it's not pure abstract like Kandinsky's, for example. I love to reduce natural appearances to radically simplified forms. I don't work in other styles like Impressionism or Expressionism, in spite of the fact that I love these artforms very much. In abstract and, as a whole, Post Modernism, I feel much freer to combine my imagination with special motifs derived from Iranian tradition, such as can be seen in my pieces named Red Fish, Silver Moon, and Golden Sun.

The colors you use are very bright and vivid. It seems that you use red, yellow and blue a lot. Why do you use such bright colors?

The truth is, I love these colors. Bright colors satisfy me a lot. I never could imagine working with mute colors which depress, tire and make me unhappy. I'm a very happy person and I really love it when I can share such happiness with others. I have always wanted my paintings to bring people happiness and relaxation, like soft music after a hard and noisy day at work. On the other hand, I can trace my color influence back to Iranian culture and traditions. Growing up I have always been exposed to vivid colors in traditional Iranian handicrafts, kilim, Gabeh, carpet, Miniatures, and so on. Additionally, when you see a Mosque topped with a blue-green dome in a light cobalt blue sky standing on a yellowish desert, the image is astoundingly beautiful. All these things have determined my color preferences, I believe.

Do you mix your colors or do you paint straight out of the tube?

Sometimes I mix colors and sometimes I don't. It depends on how I feel at the moment of creation, on the composition I'm putting together, on the subject, and on the way I want to show this.

What brand of paints are available in Teheran? What brands do you use?

Today there are many brands available in in my city. Mostly, I use Liquitex, Winsor & Newton, and Grumbacher. I am very sensitive about quality and always try to use the best materials in my painting.

What about the other art materials you use, like brushes, thinners, supports, easels. Are these manufactured in your country or are they imports? If they are imports, might this account for their high prices?

All the materials you mention are both manufactured inside the country and imported. But the truth is that this industry is not very advanced in Iran, so I prefer the imported products. These imported products are very expensive, but Iranian artists really don't have any other choice. Good materials are basic issues for all artists here.

How would a buyer in America be able to purchase your artwork?

I may be contacted through my website or e-mail. An art buyer can visit my site and check out the art there. I accept orders via e-mail and the artwork is shipped via international post. It's very simple, really. In fact, today's international postal service is a very fast and reliable one. I've never had any problems with international shipments.

What if a gallery in America wanted to show your artwork. What would they have to do?

If they don't want me to participate personally in the exhibition, I send them the pieces. They should tell me about the number of pieces they need and the acceptable sizes of the paintings for the exhibition. I would need to receive insurance for the safety of the works and assurance that the unsold pieces will be returned to me. In most cases I ship my paintings unframed because the risk of damage in transport is very high; that is, the risk of damaging the frame is very high.

If they want me to attend the exhibition in person, I would need to receive an invitation with paid lodgings. In my last exhibition in Switzerland, all the expenses had been paid for me, and I think this is a fair way of dealing with artists invited to exhibit in a foreign country.

Do you have any exhibitions planned for the near future?

For the year 2003 I had good exposure in Tehran in the Sayhun Art Gallery. There is a possibility for other shows in Tehran this year, as well. I try to exhibit my new work every fall in Switzerland, also. I haven't got any plans (or invitations) to show in other countries so far this year.

Giti's website: www.kargah.com/nourozian/index.php

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